Mormon Temple Penalties & Signs Word-for-Word the same as Masonry – Radio Free Mormon Claim.”

Mormon Temple Penalties & Signs Word-for-Word the same as Masonry – Radio Free Mormon Claim.”

Bottom Line

Parallels exist, but they don’t establish provenance. The Restoration’s temple arc is documented before and beyond Joseph’s brief Masonry window.

Podcast Radio Free Mormon (RFM)
Episode The Trouble With Temples
Title “Temple penalties & signs are almost word-for-word the same as Masonry — in the same sequence.”
Category Temple / Masonry / Historical Claim
Quote “we have sometimes almost word for word the exact same description of those penalties and we have the sequence.” — RFM
Core Claim Verbal and ordered overlap allegedly proves the LDS endowment was copied from Masonic rites.
Conclusion Misleading
Logical Questions
  • Where is the full side-by-side, source-controlled text showing “word-for-word” identity?
  • How do you control for 19th-century variation in Masonic monitors and for non-matches?

🔍 Core Finding

Church History Topics openly acknowledges limited similarities while stressing stark differences in content and intent: Masonry is a fraternal moral society; the endowment is a priesthood ordinance centered on Christ, covenants, salvation, and applies to women and men. Kirtland-era temple revelation and practice (D&C 109–110; washings & anointings) significantly predate Joseph’s March 1842 Masonic initiation, undercutting a pure “copying” thesis.

Key Points

  • Purpose ≠ Purpose: Fraternal ethics vs. salvific covenants and Christ’s Atonement.
  • Pre-1842 Trajectory: Temple theology and rites active years earlier.
  • “Sequence” Rhetoric: Without a transparent probability model, “astronomical odds” is just a flourish.

📚 Sources

RFM Claims “The exact same Five Points of Fellowship As Masonry” Including Whisper through the veil.’”

RFM Claims “The exact same Five Points of Fellowship As Masonry” Including Whisper through the veil.’”

Bottom Line

Resemblance not ≠ copy-paste. The temple’s doctrinal frame and purpose remain distinct.

Podcast Radio Free Mormon (RFM)
Episode The Trouble With Temples
Title “The exact same Five Points of Fellowship — including whisper ‘through the veil.’”
Category Temple / Masonry / Ritual Posture
Quote “We did exactly this… it was called the five points of fellowship… [and] through the veil… whispered in your ear…”
Core Claim Shared posture + whisper proves direct ritual transplant from Masonry into the temple.
Conclusion Partial Truth → Overreach
Logical Questions
  • Does posture similarity entail identity of meaning, purpose, and theology?
  • What about documented ancient Christian circle/embrace prayer precedents?

🔍 Core Rebuttal

Historic overlaps in posture existed, but LDS sources frame the endowment’s covenantal, Christ-centered aims — not fraternal ethics. Latter-day Saint prayer circles and veil symbolism operate within a creation-fall-Atonement-ascent narrative foreign to Masonic goals. Responsible comparisons weigh both similarities and differences; “exactly” overstates and collapses categories.

Key Points

  • Ritual forms can converge across traditions; theological cores may diverge sharply.
  • LDS materials acknowledge contact with Masonry while rejecting simple imitation.

📚 Sources

Temple penalties & signs are almost word-for-word the same as Masonry – RFM Claims

Temple penalties & signs are almost word-for-word the same as Masonry – RFM Claims

Bottom Line

Parallels exist, but they don’t establish provenance. The Restoration’s temple arc is documented before and beyond Joseph’s brief Masonry window.

Podcast Radio Free Mormon (RFM)
Episode The Trouble With Temples
Title “Temple penalties & signs are almost word-for-word the same as Masonry — in the same sequence.”
Category Temple / Masonry / Historical Claim
Quote “we have sometimes almost word for word the exact same description of those penalties and we have the sequence.” — RFM
Core Claim Verbal and ordered overlap allegedly proves the LDS endowment was copied from Masonic rites.
Conclusion Misleading
Logical Questions
  • Where is the full side-by-side, source-controlled text showing “word-for-word” identity?
  • How do you control for 19th-century variation in Masonic monitors and for non-matches?

🔍 Core Finding

Church History Topics openly acknowledges limited similarities while stressing stark differences in content and intent: Masonry is a fraternal moral society; the endowment is a priesthood ordinance centered on Christ, covenants, salvation, and applies to women and men. Kirtland-era temple revelation and practice (D&C 109–110; washings & anointings) significantly predate Joseph’s March 1842 Masonic initiation, undercutting a pure “copying” thesis.

Key Points

  • Purpose ≠ Purpose: Fraternal ethics vs. salvific covenants and Christ’s Atonement.
  • Pre-1842 Trajectory: Temple theology and rites active years earlier.
  • “Sequence” Rhetoric: Without a transparent probability model, “astronomical odds” is just a flourish.

📚 Sources